Cadillac ATS 2.0T Manual or Ford Focus ST?

"Jay Lauer" (thefaultinourcars)
08/30/2015 at 19:05 • Filed to: None

So yeah, there’s my question. I’m in the market for a different car now that I’ve got a big boy job in a new town (KC). The sorority girl Mazda was never meant to be a permanent stay so I thought I’d reward myself with some more fun wheels.

Both will be on the used market, because I simply don’t buy new. A good loaded up Focus ST with the Recaros, nav, HID, etc. can be had for about $20k in my area and i’ve found a couple ATS turbo manuals for around $25k.

I have yet to actually drive the ATS, but I’ve heard good things. The dealer would not let me test drive because I told them I wasn’t looking to buy today. I understand the skepticism being a skinny 22-year-old white recent grad, but come on? They had no issue letting me take out a Cayman S at the Porsche dealer an hour later, where I was just as 22 as I was the hour before. That Cayman was great, but i’d be doing it a dishonor as a daily driver parking it in an apartment complex parking lot.

So, ask any questions you need, but I’m curious what the consensus is among readers.

DISCUSSION (48)

GeorgeyBoy > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 19:10

ST.

Will probably hold value better.

G_Body_Man: Sponsored by the number 3 > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 19:10

What about a used VW CC 2.0T with the stick? Quick, sexy, roomy, fun, and affordable.

Jay Lauer > G_Body_Man: Sponsored by the number 3
08/30/2015 at 19:15

For no real reason at all, I’m just not a fan of VW’s. I liked the Mk6 GTI however. If I were to get a VW, I’d just do that.

G_Body_Man: Sponsored by the number 3 > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 19:16

What about a CPO E90?

Jay Lauer > GeorgeyBoy
08/30/2015 at 19:17

Well interesting you bring that up. I think the initial value plunge has already hit for the ST, coming down like $10k already.

Same with the ATS really, god knows what the sticker was. But since a manual ATS is more rare, it becomes a niche product that people will specifically search for. Not many people, clearly, but for that person, that’s exactly what they want.

It goes against common sense a bit, but it’s always been easier for me to sell rarer cars than more common ones.

It wouldl be a toss up between the two.

DoYouEvenShift > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 19:18

ATS!!! RWD! Manual!

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 19:19

Between the two? Cadillac every time.

Logansteno: Bought a VW? > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 19:20

I’d go ATS, but I like a little stealth and luxury with my performance. Plus RWD. It’ll probably depreciate more than the ST does though. I imagine they’ll both be really fun to drive though, I’ve never heard anything bad about either on them on that front.

Van Man, rocks the Man Van > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 19:20

ATSs are nice, but the FoST is going to be a better all-arounder. When it comes to a sporty daily driver, you can't beat a hot hatch.

Jay Lauer > G_Body_Man: Sponsored by the number 3
08/30/2015 at 19:21

I’ve considered the 135i, but the ats was always better value/miles. E90 335i’s are quite nice, but the interior is very very bland. I’m generally not an interior snob, I had a Corvette, but I feel like I’d like more.

Vicente Esteve > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 19:21

ATS, easily. Much more special IMO than the ST

JR1 > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 19:22

Lets put it this way you could own a RWD drive Cadillac at 22 with a balanced chassis, gorgeous looks, and all the history that comes with that wonderful prestigious name.

You could own a FWD Ford with a boy racer attitude. To me the answer is obvious go with the ATS. It will be infinitely more special. It is a Cadillac. Don’t get me wrong though the ST is probably a good car but it isn’t a fun rwd Caddy.

Rykros the Disdainful - Supposed Petulant Capitulant Junkie > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 19:24

The ATS turbo is pretty quick in it’s own right, and you have the benefit of RWD fun and pretty close to 50/50 weight distribution. I think they come in AWD flavors too, if you’re looking for that sort of thing. The interior is decent if you get a good color combo. I’ve test driven one, and a 3.6 back to back, and though the 3.6 is smoother and quicker, the turbo has a lot more “personality” and probably has a few more MPGs to add value to the fun.

I thought it was a decent ride. If I were in the market, I’d consider one. But I wouldn’t consider a Focus ST, because my personal taste in cars is a little different than what the FoST can offer though I’m not averse to test driving one. If I could; I haven’t found a Ford dealer yet that will let me take one out for a spin. I guess that’s the difference between a Caddy dealer that can’t move non-SUVs, and one of the hottest affordable Fords, right now.

Here’s some further reading that may be of help: http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2015-c…

From a subjective standpoint, opinions can range from “Caddy is a classier ride, Focus is more of a ruckus”, to “Oh you bought an aspirational entry-level luxury car, versus a sporty hatchback?”. The ATS looks like a classy ride, and that figures into my own personal criteria pretty decently. However, others’ opinions of what I drive matter to me less and less, over time, and it’s all about how the car makes me feel and what kind of emotions it evokes out of me. The couple hours I spent with bespoke ATS, evoked some emotion. I liked it. So that’s a good thing.

Ultimately, though, I’d probably just get a CLA. :)

G_Body_Man: Sponsored by the number 3 > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 19:25

But you’re choosing between MFT and CUE. That’s like choosing between gonnhorea and herpes.

GeorgeyBoy > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 19:28

I guess there really isn’t one way to look at it.

The following for the ST will always be bigger than a manual Cadillac. Not to mention the support of the ST.

I like the ATS more than the ST, but it just seems the ST makes more sense. Especially at this point in your life. If I bought a new Cadillac, I would get unrelentless shit from everyone at my work. I’m enough of an asshole already.

Jay Lauer > G_Body_Man: Sponsored by the number 3
08/30/2015 at 19:28

Haha good point. My mother’s Exploder has Ford touch, which I really don’t mind. I’m not keen on the placement of the screen in the Focus though. It’s really far to reach.

If they sold decent 335i’s with manuals with <30k miles or with good warranties for under $25k I’d be interested, but I have yet to see many.

TheOnelectronic > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 19:32

I think you’re looking at two very different cars. Not having experience with the ATS, but plenty with the cars cadillac designed it to beat, I’d wager it won’t hold a candle to the ST in terms of being fun to drive. It’s just not

But it will be better at being a driving around town, family sedan type of car. The Focus has plenty of room and cargo capacity and all that, but a combination of a very short fuel range and a very aggressive alignment makes it not the best highway car. So if that’s what you’re looking for...

I don’t know; maybe the ATS is much better than I’m giving it credit for, but I don’t often find myself surprised by vanilla cars.

Jay Lauer > GeorgeyBoy
08/30/2015 at 19:34

Yeah, I have considered that this probably is the right life stage to own a hot hatch boy racer car. God knows I don’t want to be too old owning one. And it’s certainly toned down from the STI.

The Cadillac has really been intriguing me as of late, but I certainly haven’t forgotten what a solid choice the ST is. A simple tune and exhaust would make it a really great autocrossable fun daily.

Putting an exhaust on a Cadillac almost seems wrong, but I’d do it. I’d have zero problem buying the Focus, it all makeks sense. The Caddy is just a kind of left-field choice which is intriguing.

With my own real money, I’m probably leaning ST, but I just like to hear opinions on all sides.

Rykros the Disdainful - Supposed Petulant Capitulant Junkie > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 19:34

I always find it funny that people say that.

I find Sync in my parent’s Edge (and formerly Explorer) to be infuriating. By contrast, when I drove the ATS, CUE seemed a lot simpler to figure out.

I must be an outlier.

Rykros the Disdainful - Supposed Petulant Capitulant Junkie > GeorgeyBoy
08/30/2015 at 19:35

At the same time, he’s going to “get shit” for being a 22 year old who bought a tarted-up Focus with gigantic wheels :)

Rykros the Disdainful - Supposed Petulant Capitulant Junkie > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 19:36

OP might want to consider waiting for the Focus RS to start selling.... that might prompt a few FoST owners to sell, and bring the used prices down a bit.

GeorgeyBoy > Rykros the Disdainful - Supposed Petulant Capitulant Junkie
08/30/2015 at 19:38

Haha. I would rather be the young asshole who drives a Focus than the young asshole who thinks he’s a VP already.

Jay Lauer > Rykros the Disdainful - Supposed Petulant Capitulant Junkie
08/30/2015 at 19:39

Oh, I’ve owned an STI, the most embarrasing cae in all the known world. Taking shit for car choices is nothing new.

I’m not sure how many ST owners will step up to RS’s, but I know 2016’s will hit lots in the next month, driving prices down.

RacinBob > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 19:39

ATS if the big boys are customers or managers in a status position and expect you to drive a big boy car. They will not undertand the Focus.

But if the big boys are 20 something racers, by all means the ST....

marshknute > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 19:40

The FoST is fun to drive. The ATS can be fun to drive.

Get the FoST.

Preferably in Tangerine Scream!

Rykros the Disdainful - Supposed Petulant Capitulant Junkie > GeorgeyBoy
08/30/2015 at 19:45

But by the same token, anyone who has money and has a luxury marque in their garage, knows that an ATS is the least expensive Caddy you can buy. So it can be seen as upstart, sure, but it might also have the positive “aspirational” connotation, too.

Chargingstar - E92 M3 pilot > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 19:45

Drive them both, choose the one that makes you smile the most. If you have expectations, make sure they are clear and out in the open. Cozy commuter, track day toy, luxury date machine, keep it stock, mod it to un-reliability etc.

They are both amazing machines in their own rights. But they aren’t even close enough to compare. Which options are deal breakers for you? Is this a car you can see yourself in for a long while or just a stopgap until the next four wheeled folly?

The car you love in reviews, articles, internet videos and online forums may be a freaking dud in your garage or worse, a dud with you in the driver’s seat. Based on your two choices you want an amazing driving experience, and you won’t know for sure which of these cars will check that box for you until you drive them.

If you’re taking our internet opinions, I HATE the Cadillac. I recognize that recently Cadillac makes amazing machines that are still luxurious and competitive at the track. I spent a season in auto-x wondering how in the hell this freaking CTS-V monstrosity in my class bracket kept getting faster... I can’t see myself driving it, not for a day and definitely not for a prolonged period of time.

I thought I would love the ST, coming from a 2008 Evo. It was too juvenile, too boy-racerish for me despite, like with the Cadillac, the car being an amazing machine.

Sounds like you have a fun dilemma on your hands. Keep us in the loop on your journey and of course, hit us with pictures when you make your choice.

Rykros the Disdainful - Supposed Petulant Capitulant Junkie > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 19:46

Here’s another question: which car do you think the ladies will notice, if you know, you care about attracting women? :) (most don’t care that much about the car you drive other than “is it comfortable and easy to get in and out of?”)

From the angle of a gay man, the ATS would impress and attract more guys than a Focus would. ST or not. I mean, it’s no BMW or M-B, but it’s not a Ford, and Lincoln may as well not even be in the running.

bryan40oop > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 19:50

Obvious answer is obvious

Kinja'd!!!

GeorgeyBoy > Rykros the Disdainful - Supposed Petulant Capitulant Junkie
08/30/2015 at 19:52

True. On the other hand, I drive a shitty old Lincoln and still get shit for it.

Guess it depends on the industry really.

michael bleggi > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 19:53

i like the ST without the recaros much more. my friend traded his recaros out with another local ST owners. just something to look into, and it could get you a much cheaper ST if you like them more. I have nothing to say about the ATS.... but the ST is a fucking blast.

Rykros the Disdainful - Supposed Petulant Capitulant Junkie > GeorgeyBoy
08/30/2015 at 19:55

Or which automaker’s lot you have to park in :)

Jay Lauer > Rykros the Disdainful - Supposed Petulant Capitulant Junkie
08/30/2015 at 20:02

I’ve owned a lot of neat sports cars. The only one a girl has ever said anything about was my shitty high mileage E46 BMW. I learned a long long time ago that girls don’t really care what you drive.

I do admit, I like the bit of prestige that comes from a Caddy badge, but for me. I feel like I can’t be faulted too much for the cheap caddy being a 22 yr old young professional. By the same token, I’m the target demographic for a Focus ST.

As someone that likes autocross, the FoST is probably the better choice, but both would have warranties, so who cares really. I’m not competitive on lap times. I just need to drive an ATS to see.

Jay Lauer > michael bleggi
08/30/2015 at 20:03

Well I’m 5’11” 160 lbs, so I fit in the seats no problem.

I’m sure, like all seats, they’ll get uncomfortable on road trips, but I’ve liked them in friends cars and such.

Rykros the Disdainful - Supposed Petulant Capitulant Junkie > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 20:44

You really need to just drive.

Also, might be a difference in insurance cost between the two. However, given the history of what you’ve driven, that cost doesn’t appear to be a factor (sure was when I was 22, heh)

Carbon Fiber Sasquatch > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 20:49

I was in a similar situation, I thought I wanted a Ford Focus ST but then I saw that 2.0 Turbo ATS’s are going for the same amount. The Cadillac is a lot more car and that’s what I would have gone with if my current car didn’t need work done. I get to wait until next summer for my new car.

Also if the Ford dealership is being weird about letting you drive the car but the Caddy dealership is cool, just remember who you want to be interacting with for the next few years for service...

Carbon Fiber Sasquatch > JR1
08/30/2015 at 20:53

My thoughts exactly, the Caddy is going to look more professional and still be fun to drive

qbeezy > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 21:30

Congrats! I’m a bit jelly cause u want to move back! ATS all the way. If you want luxury with performance, go with ATS.

Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 21:34

At my job, there are 3 Focus hatchbacks in the parking lot (only 1 FoST). They are driven by two admin secretaries and one part-time salesperson. There is one Cadillac, a supercharged STS-V, which is driven by our most aloof, probably highest-profit-per-job salesperson.

pitstop_pitowski > Jay Lauer
08/30/2015 at 22:09

As an ST owner, I have to say MFT is not very good and the heat soak will drive you nuts until you replace the stock intercooler. Also needs a brake upgrade for track use, and if nothing else you have to get a separate set of tires and wheels for the winter. As a homeowner this isn’t a big deal, but you said you live in an apartment. Those Eagle F1’s turn into hockey pucks below 30°. Hyundai Genesis Coupe? VW GTI? You should pick wisely, take your time.

boxrocket > Jay Lauer
08/31/2015 at 06:51

ST. There’s a reason the ATS has depreciated so badly. Chintzy, cramped interior, CUE sucks balls, visibility is so-so, and having seat vibrations instead of an audible backup alarm is completely irritating and counter-intuitive, and despite being smaller than a Cts, it feels almost as long, but much narrower (in a bad way). The only likable thing about the ats is that it’s RWD.

MuchWagon > G_Body_Man: Sponsored by the number 3
08/31/2015 at 08:28

I don’t know this from experience, just Dave Chapelles “kneehigh park” and public school health class 20 years ago, but gonnorhea is curable and herpes says (in his own words) “Im better than your best friend, I’ll stay with you to the end. You wont see me everyday! But now and again ill stop in and say hey”.

So kids, if ever confronted by this seemingly no-win scenario, choose gonnorhea! Erm.. MFT!

Jay Lauer > pitstop_pitowski
08/31/2015 at 11:03

The Mk7 GTI is still on my radar. I just want to find a used one. I've seen some in the $23-24k range. I quite liked the mk6 I drove.

Jay Lauer > qbeezy
08/31/2015 at 11:05

Move back?

Jay Lauer > Carbon Fiber Sasquatch
08/31/2015 at 11:07

Other way around. I’ve driven an ST, the caddy dealer qas being weird. I had no intention of buying from that dealer, but I was just surprised.

If I could, I'd buy a Cayman based off that test drive.

qbeezy > Jay Lauer
08/31/2015 at 12:50

My bad I want to move back to kc

Carbon Fiber Sasquatch > Jay Lauer
08/31/2015 at 19:25

Oh yeah, that is weird. Focus ST’s are super popular and sell really quick while ATS’s sit on lots, you’d think they’d let anyone who wants to drive one drive it. If you have a shitty Caddy dealer around you, I’d take the ST or use a different dealer lol

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > Jay Lauer
11/30/2015 at 22:13

apples and oranges,